What is the best brand for Phosphate test kit?

[DanK.Reefer]

The problem is that the Redsea refractometer always has a slightly higher reading levels than the Milwaukee. It's kind of hard to explain this but let me try. When I come up with a test result from the Milwaukee at between 1.024 and 1.025 (I press the button about 3 to 4 times) the Red Sea's refractometer says that I'm at 1.0255ish

I have not used the milwuakee refractometer so I cannot attest to its functions. I can possibly share some insight into the refractometer conundrums. The main problem being that refractometers measure refractive index and hydrometers measure specific gravity. It is possible that there are trace elements or minerals in the water that do not cross reference the same refractive index as they do the specific gravity index. Then when you throw in the wild herring that the temperature can affect all of the test readings it really can make things a challenge.

I have some refractometers that say to calibrate with NSW and others that say to use RODI. I cross reference the readings to my float hydrometer and hopefully find a good medium.

Oh don't even get me started with the Hanna Salilinity wand that thing is junk. I threw it in the trash. Nobody should use that POS, you may as well taste the water and guess.

In one of my tanks the salilinity tends to trend up due to 2 part dosing. To keep things in check I remove a half gallon to a gallon of water every week and let the ATO compensate to keep things right.

 

[Jimbo327]

Index to TM hydrometer. That is the standard.

Buy a plastic graduated cylinder, so you can fill and fit the hydrometer while testing. In a pinch, you can use the plastic cover of the hydrometer as well to hold water and measure.

BTW, it’s not recommended to calibrate with DI water because it is not as accurate as calibrating to a seawater standard.

 

[drexel]

There are two refractometers I would buy/use, one being the VeeGee STX-3, which is $130 or the DD Ocean refractometer, which is considerably less at $60. Once my DD no longer holds calibration, still going strong for 10 years now, I'll buy the VeeGee. You calibrate with a known solution at 35ppt, which you can make yourself with table salt, RHF has a recipe. It requires a precise scale, but I usually triple the amount in order to it easier to weigh. It's table salt, so if you throw it out after calibrating, you're not throwing away much. Then I back up my reading with the TM hydrometer. The difference in salinity means the concentration of ions are less then what they would be at 35ppt. So when you test parameters, calcium, mag, alk, etc, will actually be less than they would at 35ppt. Ideally, we want to keep our tanks at 35ppt, that's where all of our testing is based on. Long term, having lower salinity in a reef tank will probably cause some issues, but short term, I don't think you'll see much difference. That being said, I would strive to keep your tank at 35ppt or close to it as possible. My tanks usually hover around 35ppt, but have been 34 to 36ppt without issue. I usually try to correct it when I check.
Yes, you want to keep salinity as stable as possible, but if yours moves a little over time, that's normal and just correct it slowly. But, if your is changing rapidly every day, then that's something I would correct going forward.

 

[drexel]

DIY calibration solution is 3.65g of table salt into 96.35g of RO. I just scale up and multiply each and make a larger batch, unless you have a precise scale that measures down to 1/100 or 0.01, it's easier to make larger batches.

 

[drexel]

Also, I would probably invest in a good ATO. You can pick up a used Tunze 3155 and if you ever need to swap out the sensor, Roger does that repair for around $40 (I think?) and the pumps are around $25. Or just bite the bullet and get the new version with the better pump. I would spend money on a good ATO in order to keep things stable, than buy an overpriced light. Water parameters are far more important than lighting, because you can grow coral with inexpensive LED's, but it's pretty hard to grow coral with crappy water.

 

[happyreefer]

I have not used the milwuakee refractometer so I cannot attest to its functions. I can possibly share some insight into the refractometer conundrums. The main problem being that refractometers measure refractive index and hydrometers measure specific gravity. It is possible that there are trace elements or minerals in the water that do not cross reference the same refractive index as they do the specific gravity index. Then when you throw in the wild herring that the temperature can affect all of the test readings it really can make things a challenge.

I have some refractometers that say to calibrate with NSW and others that say to use RODI. I cross reference the readings to my float hydrometer and hopefully find a good medium.

Oh don't even get me started with the Hanna Salilinity wand that thing is junk. I threw it in the trash. Nobody should use that POS, you may as well taste the water and guess.

In one of my tanks the salilinity tends to trend up due to 2 part dosing. To keep things in check I remove a half gallon to a gallon of water every week and let the ATO compensate to keep things right.

Does the NSW acronym stand for non salt water? Never heard of that one before. Regarding the specific gravity vs refractive measurement, I read about that a long time ago and couldn't really make of it but I was able to kind of get what they're trying to say, that one is better than the other. I think what you're saying is that the specific gravity is the optimum way of measurement for salinity. Yes, the temperature relative to salinity level was really confusing for me lol. I was like "wow, how can that be even possible?" Lol.

 

[happyreefer]

Index to TM hydrometer. That is the standard.

Buy a plastic graduated cylinder, so you can fill and fit the hydrometer while testing. In a pinch, you can use the plastic cover of the hydrometer as well to hold water and measure.

BTW, it’s not recommended to calibrate with DI water because it is not as accurate as calibrating to a seawater standard.

Gotcha, great idea! One less reefing equipment in the kitchen or home lol. I keep most of my stuff in the kitchen lol. I started calibrating my Red Sea's refractormeter because the Milwaukee electronic device can only calibrate with their "zero" function. In other words, the only way it allows for calibration is with non salt water. It says to use deionized water to calibrate to zero. So I started to calibrate the Red Sea's refractormeter to zero with the same water. But you're right! The Red Sea's refractormeter is supposed to be calibrated with ppt salt water. I resorted to DI water thinking it should be fine but I regret it now that I'm thinking about again. Thanks for pointing that out, I really should order some of the premade ppt salt water in the bottle.

 

[happyreefer]

There are two refractometers I would buy/use, one being the VeeGee STX-3, which is $130 or the DD Ocean refractometer, which is considerably less at $60. Once my DD no longer holds calibration, still going strong for 10 years now, I'll buy the VeeGee. You calibrate with a known solution at 35ppt, which you can make yourself with table salt, RHF has a recipe. It requires a precise scale, but I usually triple the amount in order to it easier to weigh. It's table salt, so if you throw it out after calibrating, you're not throwing away much. Then I back up my reading with the TM hydrometer. The difference in salinity means the concentration of ions are less then what they would be at 35ppt. So when you test parameters, calcium, mag, alk, etc, will actually be less than they would at 35ppt. Ideally, we want to keep our tanks at 35ppt, that's where all of our testing is based on. Long term, having lower salinity in a reef tank will probably cause some issues, but short term, I don't think you'll see much difference. That being said, I would strive to keep your tank at 35ppt or close to it as possible. My tanks usually hover around 35ppt, but have been 34 to 36ppt without issue. I usually try to correct it when I check.
Yes, you want to keep salinity as stable as possible, but if yours moves a little over time, that's normal and just correct it slowly. But, if your is changing rapidly every day, then that's something I would correct going forward.

If I make my own 35ppt water with table salt, how will I measure it if my refractormeter is suspect? I can't seem to figure that one out. So you're saying I have to use a scale to measure the amount of salt needed for 35ppt? I still don't get what you mean by that. If you don't mind trying that one more time, I would appreciate it.

When you say, "The difference in salinity means the concentration of ions are less then what they would be at 35ppt", what does that mean? It sounds like you're elaborating by saying, "So when you test parameters, calcium, mag, alk, etc, will actually be less than they would at 35ppt" but I still don't get it.

Yeah, I definitely want to keep my salinity at 35ppt if I can. The problem is that I can never seem to do that, really sucks!

 

[happyreefer]

DIY calibration solution is 3.65g of table salt into 96.35g of RO. I just scale up and multiply each and make a larger batch, unless you have a precise scale that measures down to 1/100 or 0.01, it's easier to make larger batches.

Okay, so here it is lol. As much as I want to give it a go, I'm not so sure if I can pull it off. Are saying you're measuring RO water in grams? That's what it sounds like.

 

[happyreefer]

Also, I would probably invest in a good ATO. You can pick up a used Tunze 3155 and if you ever need to swap out the sensor, Roger does that repair for around $40 (I think?) and the pumps are around $25. Or just bite the bullet and get the new version with the better pump. I would spend money on a good ATO in order to keep things stable, than buy an overpriced light. Water parameters are far more important than lighting, because you can grow coral with inexpensive LED's, but it's pretty hard to grow coral with crappy water.

Great timing sir, my Tunze 3155 sensor just broke last week. Can I ask, who is Roger? I don't want to throw away the 3155. I just love that thing lol. I saw on BRS that the 3155 is no more. There's a new version out now. I definitely wouldn't mind spending 40 instead of 250 for the new version although the new version seems to have some good reviews, a lot of people seem to like it a lot. Yup! Good water parameter is the most important ingredient for a healthy reeftank. I agree 100%

 

[Jimbo327]

Roger Vitko is the US rep for Tunze. You usually send him broken equipment to be fixed. Not sure if they will fix 3155 tho. He may be over at R2R or you can find Tubze website.

 

[Jimbo327]

You are overthinking this. Get the graduated cylinder and TM hydrometer. Then use this to measure your tank water, it’s as simple as that. That’s your salinity. Let’s say it measure 1.024.

Then take one of your other instruments and measure the same tank water. Even if that is off, that’s okay. It reads 1.022. You just know that 1.022 is actually 1.024. You don’t need to recalibrate. Just add .02 to the reading. This is indexing to the TM hydrometer.

Why index to TM hydrometer instead of using it? More for ease of use everyday. You don’t have to get a cylinder of tank water everytime you want to measure salinity. And from time to time, verify against TM hydrometer. That’s how I use and index all of my probes. Even the Apex salinity probe, it’s off. I only use it for trend and I know how far off based on TM hydrometer.

 

[bakbay]

So… speaking of overthinking, I used to remember and test based on specific gravity for decades. With my new Apex Pro + salinity probe (yes, calibrated) it’s in ppt. Which unit is better? lol j/k I’ve been retraining my little brain to think 35ppt recently, would be nice to have the Apex report as SG for old guys like me.

Edit - thanks to AI: there is a way. Be right back! Crap - need the desktop version but I’m on mobile. Will do this later
Edit2: nvm - AI hallucinations back to old Fusion. There is no such thing to create & graph another input and convert it.

 

[drexel]

Great timing sir, my Tunze 3155 sensor just broke last week. Can I ask, who is Roger? I don't want to throw away the 3155. I just love that thing lol. I saw on BRS that the 3155 is no more. There's a new version out now. I definitely wouldn't mind spending 40 instead of 250 for the new version although the new version seems to have some good reviews, a lot of people seem to like it a lot. Yup! Good water parameter is the most important ingredient for a healthy reeftank. I agree 100%

As Jimbo mention, Roger is Tunze's US rep and all things Tunze for the USA. There's a thread on R2R in the Tunze sponsor section "optical sensor replacement" where you'll find the info for sending in the the head unit and the sensor. I sent mine in a couple years ago (not because it wasn't working) to have it replaced to give it a longer lifespan. I think it's around $40 or so, I forget. But connect with Roger directly and he'll get it fixed for you. You'll just send the head unit and the attached cables, no magnet mount or power supply. It only took about a week or so total round trip.
This is for the 3155, btw.

 

[drexel]

Okay, so here it is lol. As much as I want to give it a go, I'm not so sure if I can pull it off. Are saying you're measuring RO water in grams? That's what it sounds like.

Yes, 1mL of RO weighs 1 gram.

 

[happyreefer]

Yes, 1mL of RO weighs 1 gram.

Oh I see, gotcha

As Jimbo mention, Roger is Tunze's US rep and all things Tunze for the USA. There's a thread on R2R in the Tunze sponsor section "optical sensor replacement" where you'll find the info for sending in the the head unit and the sensor. I sent mine in a couple years ago (not because it wasn't working) to have it replaced to give it a longer lifespan. I think it's around $40 or so, I forget. But connect with Roger directly and he'll get it fixed for you. You'll just send the head unit and the attached cables, no magnet mount or power supply. It only took about a week or so total round trip.
This is for the 3155, btw.

Sounds good, thanks for all the info drexel!!

So… speaking of overthinking, I used to remember and test based on specific gravity for decades. With my new Apex Pro + salinity probe (yes, calibrated) it’s in ppt. Which unit is better? lol j/k I’ve been retraining my little brain to think 35ppt recently, would be nice to have the Apex report as SG for old guys like me.

Edit - thanks to AI: there is a way. Be right back! Crap - need the desktop version but I’m on mobile. Will do this later
Edit2: nvm - AI hallucinations back to old Fusion. There is no such thing to create & graph another input and convert it.

I definitely like the SG readings a lot better as well. The ppt readings are a little to scientific for me

 

[happyreefer]

You are overthinking this. Get the graduated cylinder and TM hydrometer. Then use this to measure your tank water, it’s as simple as that. That’s your salinity. Let’s say it measure 1.024.

Then take one of your other instruments and measure the same tank water. Even if that is off, that’s okay. It reads 1.022. You just know that 1.022 is actually 1.024. You don’t need to recalibrate. Just add .02 to the reading. This is indexing to the TM hydrometer.

Why index to TM hydrometer instead of using it? More for ease of use everyday. You don’t have to get a cylinder of tank water everytime you want to measure salinity. And from time to time, verify against TM hydrometer. That’s how I use and index all of my probes. Even the Apex salinity probe, it’s off. I only use it for trend and I know how far off based on TM hydrometer.

I get what you're saying but I always have to calibrate both my instruments once in a while because the reading is sometimes a moving target. There are times when I don't have to calibrate for weeks, or sometimes for months but sooner or later the reading starts to jump around. This is why I alway calibrate my stuff. But I do get what you're saying. I should really try using the TM hydrometer to see how I do. Thanks for the feedback!

 

[drexel]

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-06/rhf/index.php

 

[Discotu]

Agree ive been using the TM hydrometer for ages and have broken and replaced too many to count but keep going back to it. Its super straight forward with little temp correction. That said im not too anal about my measurements...i can sometimes be off by several ppt in either direction and my tank doesnt care. They are super fagile though... one time when ordering a replacement it shipped broken 3 times in a row.