60G 24x24x24 build, first tank

[pledosophy]

IME it is hard to impossible to get a tank, of almost any size, proper flow with only one powerhead.

On my 50g I actually have 3. One blows behind the rocks and blows everything out, one in the back right corner blowing over the top of the scape and bringing food down to the LPS on the sand, and an MP 10 on the side on reef crest. All 3 go on and off and cycle throughout the day so the flow is never consistently one thing.

It took me about 5 years in the hobby to realize just how important keeping the water moving different directions really was, and honestly the next 10 years to kinda master it. It makes a huge difference IME in keeping the tank clean, and keeping everything healthy. So many issues are caused by to low of, or wrongly placed powerheads. I am glad you are tackling it at the start.

I would give your cycle a few more day, making sure to keep the ammoinia at or below 1ppm (if it goes over 1ppm it kills the bacteria you are trying to grow), and then start dosing some bacteria and some live phyto. Work the chain up smallest to largest. Bacteria, phyto, pods, then fish.

Hope that helps.

 

[CoffBoss]

What helps me figure out the flow thing is I have this a disc of gsp and a disc of xenia. That I move around to see how the flow is. Lol I keep these guys solely to see flow. But most of the time I toss them on the sand bed in the other system so they don’t go crazy spreading on my dt

maybe I can borrow those discs for a few days haha

 

[CoffBoss]

IME it is hard to impossible to get a tank, of almost any size, proper flow with only one powerhead.

On my 50g I actually have 3. One blows behind the rocks and blows everything out, one in the back right corner blowing over the top of the scape and bringing food down to the LPS on the sand, and an MP 10 on the side on reef crest. All 3 go on and off and cycle throughout the day so the flow is never consistently one thing.

It took me about 5 years in the hobby to realize just how important keeping the water moving different directions really was, and honestly the next 10 years to kinda master it. It makes a huge difference IME in keeping the tank clean, and keeping everything healthy. So many issues are caused by to low of, or wrongly placed powerheads. I am glad you are tackling it at the start.

I would give your cycle a few more day, making sure to keep the ammoinia at or below 1ppm (if it goes over 1ppm it kills the bacteria you are trying to grow), and then start dosing some bacteria and some live phyto. Work the chain up smallest to largest. Bacteria, phyto, pods, then fish.

Hope that helps.

noted and yeah seems important and I want to do it right and have as much success/fun as possible. I moved the WAV again a bit down and closer to the overflow and gave it a slight angle up and I am not getting so much blast in one corner now so I think I’ve found a good spot for that one. I think I am gonna pick up a second and toss it in the other side of the overflow on side wall to get that cross flow and that should really stir up the back of the tank. I’ve noticed the sand is moving through my rock formation with the current placement so I believe I have the whole tank moving at this point but as you said more is better and one is not optimal to cover the whole tank.

in terms of cycling my ammonia is hovering at 0.25ppm at the moment haven’t seen any spikes and I have a few media bags in the sump now. I also dosed some dr tims one and only so hoping it goes well but I am eager to get a fish in there! Haha my nitrite/nitrate is still zero though so I am not cycled for sure.

hardest part is remaining patient so far

 

[sklywag]

A gallon a day? Wow! My tank is in garage and down a gallon and almost another half Since Monday at 8:30 am as you can see. Gets direct sunlight in the late afternoon and when the chiller kicks in usually. If I crack the garage door and get a breeze it shuts off. I do have a top on my tank. Not sure how you feel about tops, but may want to consider one. There will be those that say no way (Jose). They also help in maintaining a more consistent temperature in small amounts. But when counting degrees, they add up.
All those bubbles in the return section when they pop add to eval as well. You can see all the water on the sides. When it dries your salinity will fall and that also adds up hourly, daily, weekly.
I use flake food for flow tests added through the return to see its current and how it pushes it around the tank. Then you can see the eddies that need attention. Doesn’t take much to see and it helps with the cycle.
I always have a hard time with flow and never happy with it. Firm believer in big CUC. Cucumbers are usually are good for those dark low flow areas.
I point my skimmer intake towards the drain section to suck in as much tank water as possible and turn the exit towards the intake as well to try and recycle that water again through skimmer a second time. Work? Mentally it does.
My quirks and features of doing things. Do as you may.

 

[CoffBoss]

A gallon a day? Wow! My tank is in garage and down a gallon and almost another half Since Monday at 8:30 am as you can see. Gets direct sunlight in the late afternoon and when the chiller kicks in usually. If I crack the garage door and get a breeze it shuts off. I do have a top on my tank. Not sure how you feel about tops, but may want to consider one. There will be those that say no way (Jose). They also help in maintaining a more consistent temperature in small amounts. But when counting degrees, they add up.
All those bubbles in the return section when they pop add to eval as well. You can see all the water on the sides. When it dries your salinity will fall and that also adds up hourly, daily, weekly.
I use flake food for flow tests added through the return to see its current and how it pushes it around the tank. Then you can see the eddies that need attention. Doesn’t take much to see and it helps with the cycle.
I always have a hard time with flow and never happy with it. Firm believer in big CUC. Cucumbers are usually are good for those dark low flow areas.
I point my skimmer intake towards the drain section to suck in as much tank water as possible and turn the exit towards the intake as well to try and recycle that water again through skimmer a second time. Work? Mentally it does.
My quirks and features of doing things. Do as you may.

only 0.5 (1/2) gallon a day at the moment, but I suspect not having the filter sock in was helping that. I pulled it out for 48 hours per the recommendation of Dr. Tim’s one and only so all of those bubbles and splashing you see in that previous pic are gone now. I do have a screen top for the tank but I was not considering running a lid just yet. So far I don’t seem to have any issues with temp but it’s not summer and I was planning on running a fan across the surface for cooling since a chiller in my living room doesn’t sound like a good idea to me. I am always willing to keep my options open of course but my AC works well so I don’t think it will be necessary and maybe just the stand fan will be enough… only time will tell.

Side note ~1/3 gallon a day evaporation sounds pretty good, that would be nice. I have a fair amount of surface agitation at the moment with the return and playing around with the WAV so I might be able to cut it down however 1/2 gallon a day seems to be pretty standard for those not running lids on everything.

 

[sklywag]

I’m actually wrong on my evap. It’s really only about 3/4 a gallon since Monday. It was at the top of the blue tape which each line is a half gallon.
Yes, whole house AC is sufficient in replacing a chiller. At least in my house it was. During the summer we keep house about 70 degrees, 68 in winter.
Again this small tank I have now is in garage. Bigger temperature swings.
Maybe an Iceprobe style might be a good low cost and quiet addition.

 

[SandStorm]

following along...

 

[CoffBoss]

I’m actually wrong on my evap. It’s really only about 3/4 a gallon since Monday. It was at the top of the blue tape which each line is a half gallon.
Yes, whole house AC is sufficient in replacing a chiller. At least in my house it was. During the summer we keep house about 70 degrees, 68 in winter.
Again this small tank I have now is in garage. Bigger temperature swings.
Maybe an Iceprobe style might be a good low cost and quiet addition.

Wow 3/4 gallon is even more impressive! How big is the tank you are running now? Maybe I will look into a top after all haha, having it open is nice but not refilling ATO all the time sounds pretty good too haha.

 

[CoffBoss]

following along...

thanks, I’ve got a couple clowns in the tank now. Still monitoring the water Params (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate) waiting for the cycle to fully finish. Right now I am running no lights to try and prevent algae growth as much as possible and I am going to toss some snails in at the end of the week to help even more.

my first non-fish animal planned at the moment is going to be an anemone to make sure it stays put then I will start looking at coral. I am still planning a few more fish and have pretty much settled on tomini tang, six line, and lawnmower blenny. Plus I will toss a cleaner shrimp in once the tank is fully cycled for some extra cleanup.

I also picked up a second WAV power head but I haven’t tossed it in the tank just yet. The one is honestly producing some god flow where I have it now and at full power this thing pushes water out of the tank. We shall see how it works out in the end but I like having the options!

 

[sklywag]

Looking good. Sand type? Looks straight from the beach. nice and natural. Man that glass is clear. I like the normal Percula(?)clowns as well. My tank is scratched badly. Problem with a $40 setup. Lost one of my clowns into the overflow, then the sock. Found it covered in copepods. Little guy always hung out by the overflow, about 1/2”. Need to find a partner for the other.
It’s an oddball tank. 36x15x17. Like 37/8 gallons. My sump, 15 gallon holds about 9 constant. I lose about 3 when or if off power so no worries on losing any water. My stand is enclosed like yours with about 4 inches across top rear for humidity control inside it. The top on my tank has no more than about 3/8 of an inch between front and rear pieces so pretty tight. Like you see on the tanks like yours when they use those clear plastic clips to hold the top.
Through out the day the condensation on the inside of it comes and goes a few times depending on ambient temperature. Chiller is set to 78 degrees. But being a fairly tight setup there isn’t much heat loss either during cool nights. If I crack the garage door there’s a breeze that passes by and keeps it cool.

 

[CoffBoss]

Looking good. Sand type? Looks straight from the beach. nice and natural. Man that glass is clear. I like the normal Percula(?)clowns as well. My tank is scratched badly. Problem with a $40 setup. Lost one of my clowns into the overflow, then the sock. Found it covered in copepods. Little guy always hung out by the overflow, about 1/2”. Need to find a partner for the other.
It’s an oddball tank. 36x15x17. Like 37/8 gallons. My sump, 15 gallon holds about 9 constant. I lose about 3 when or if off power so no worries on losing any water. My stand is enclosed like yours with about 4 inches across top rear for humidity control inside it. The top on my tank has no more than about 3/8 of an inch between front and rear pieces so pretty tight. Like you see on the tanks like yours when they use those clear plastic clips to hold the top.
Through out the day the condensation on the inside of it comes and goes a few times depending on ambient temperature. Chiller is set to 78 degrees. But being a fairly tight setup there isn’t much heat loss either during cool nights. If I crack the garage door there’s a breeze that passes by and keeps it cool.

The sand is dry aragonite from Petco, apparently it is a special blend just for petco with special grade sizing in the 1-2mm range. I do like it though, after giving it a good rinse went in super easy and no dust. I do get some movement but pretty minimal considering the flow.

Thanks haha, I put a lot of elbow grease in to cleanthe tank when I got it used. Had a ton of coralline algae buildup amongst other things, but it cleaned up nicely! The stand did as well, the whole setup started off a bit rough to be honest but overall I am pretty happy with it!

The clowns are actually ocellaris of the gladiator flavor. Their helmets aren’t to crazy but the wife and I both liked them and she wanted orange haha. The black outlines on these guys are a bit more distinct like the percula, but the eyes are dark and I can’t count the number of spines.

I went with all dry media because I was starting with the media bags that had been cooking, but soon there will be some growth I am sure. Your DT almost sounds like a 40B, which is 36x16x18 standard I have a couple haha.

I have thought about trying to make a cheap cover for the top with plexiglass or acrylic from Home Depot but we shall see. I have a Red Sea screen top sitting next to the tank at the moment that I want to assemble and that should keep most of the animals out of my overflow but where there is a will there is a way. Right now these clowns don’t go anywhere near the overflow, they mostly hang in the bottom corners but have been riding the currents along the glass haha. I haven’t seen them venture into the rock work much yet but they have only been in here a few days so I am sure they will eventually.

 

[sklywag]

Orange with stripes, they all look alike to me, but they’re the ones I like.
Not quite a 40B. It’s off by a couple inches in both ways but it is 36” long.

 

[CoffBoss]

Orange with stripes, they all look alike to me, but they’re the ones I like.
Not quite a 40B. It’s off by a couple inches in both ways but it is 36” long.

I agree they do look nice, I like the orange as well. Yeah just shy of the 40B haha

I picked up a 7 gallon jug for my ATO for vacations for now, I have a couple trips coming up and the 3 gallon is right on the edge so I don’t wanna roll the dice haha. It won’t fit in my stand though so I’m gonna jus set it next to the stand with the door off as a temporary solution for those instances for now.

 

[CoffBoss]

Alright made a trip to the LFS today to look at snails, fish, and coral… mostly just for fun and I’m having a hard time locking down my fish list. Looking for some input from those who have experience with some of these fish.

I have the two clowns now, so those are staying.

I was planning, likely in this order:

4 trochus, 2 turbo snails
lawnmower blenny
Cleaner shrimp
Tomini tang
Sixline wrasse
Considering blue stripe cleaner wrasse instead
Considering yellow eye kole tang instead/in addition to

many have mentioned to me, including LFS, that the sixline might be aggressive towards the shrimp and other tank mates. So. Oh I am considering a blue stripe cleaner wrasse instead which shouldn’t be aggressive and could help the tangs. I mostly wanted the sixline because they look cool and they eat pests like aiptasia and bristle worms. It seems like the cleaner wrasse might do the same though.

I was also targeting the tomini because I couldn’t find a yellow eye kole, but that has changed! So any reason why I shouldn’t get the yellow eye kole instead of or maybe even in addition to the tomini? Again I think they just look awesome and another good utilitarian fish.

I am also looking at putting 4 trochus snails and 2 turbo snails in to help out as well. These could be in place of the shrimp or in addition to and I was likely going to toss them in soon to try and keep the diatoms down for my up and coming ugly phase.

I wanted to limit the fish to 5/6 for now

thoughts and/or feedback?

 

[pledosophy]

I would suggest turning your lights on and letting that algae grow. It is going to grow at some point, it is better to start it sooner than later.

I would add a nassarius snail or three to your clean up plans. They are great for stirring and mixing up the sand. They have this snorkel like thing that comes out of the top of their heads. Very cool snail. Once the tank is more established I find small urchins to be incredible cleaners and very fun to watch. If you get the CB ones they come in very small.

6 line will definitely be aggressive towards shrimp. It's a when not an if IME. If you are going to get a cleaner shrimp, I would get two. They play with each other at times which is fun to watch.

For tangs you need to pick one or the other. I had a Kole tang and loved it. Oddly enough the Hawaiian name for Kole tang translates to Raw, because that is how they are traditionally served there; but don't eat yours.

If you haven't added it yet, if it were my tank I would begin to dose phytoplankton and add a mix of pods now. Tisbe are the important ones for me, but several breeders sell a mix of pods and that is great too. I build the biological cycle from the bottom up. Bacteria, micro fauna, pods, fish, coral.

 

[CoffBoss]

I would suggest turning your lights on and letting that algae grow. It is going to grow at some point, it is better to start it sooner than later.

that’s a fair point, my phosphates are 0.03 ppm so shouldn’t see a ton of bloom is what I am thinking. I am gonna turn them on haha

I would add a nassarius snail or three to your clean up plans. They are great for stirring and mixing up the sand. They have this snorkel like thing that comes out of the top of their heads. Very cool snail. Once the tank is more established I find small urchins to be incredible cleaners and very fun to watch. If you get the CB ones they come in very small.

6 line will definitely be aggressive towards shrimp. It's a when not an if IME. If you are going to get a cleaner shrimp, I would get two. They play with each other at times which is fun to watch.

Cool I will see if the LFS has those, I do need something to stir sand! I only ended up picking up 1 turbo and 2 trochus because I still don’t see a lot of algae growth. They are cruising the tank and seem to be eating stuff off the rocks… so I guess they are doing their job.

the sixline seems so popular and I read about so many fish being aggressive, so I think I’m just going to do it and get one. The LFS suggested I put the shrimp in first which might help with the aggression of the sixline (or maybe I’ll just get a chill one) and I need my ammonia to be zero (still hovering at 0.25 ppm) and likely some more algae before I should toss them in.

Same really for the blenny, I was gonna put him in next but without much algae I dunno if he will have a lot to eat so imma wait

For tangs you need to pick one or the other. I had a Kole tang and loved it. Oddly enough the Hawaiian name for Kole tang translates to Raw, because that is how they are traditionally served there; but don't eat yours.

If you haven't added it yet, if it were my tank I would begin to dose phytoplankton and add a mix of pods now. Tisbe are the important ones for me, but several breeders sell a mix of pods and that is great too. I build the biological cycle from the bottom up. Bacteria, micro fauna, pods, fish, coral.

I guess both the yellow eye and tomini are kole so can’t have both, makes sense. Any other tang I could put in with the yellow eye or maybe another fish you would suggest? At this point I am leaning towards 6 fish is where I am at haha.

I am glad you mentioned that, I do have a bottle of pods that I got as a door gift at the CFM and I should prob toss those in. I was going to toss some rock rubble in the fuge area should I dump them in there or just go straight in the DT?

the pods I have are “apex pods”, pic below

 

[sklywag]

Your kitchen just on the other side of the wall? Where is the fridge? This coming week I’m going to be tapping into my ice maker line and run 1/4” tube from it to my float valve. Do away with the jug. Might work for you too depending if your fridge is close by. My fridge and tank are back to back. Have a whole house filter plus another just for ice maker. Haven’t had any issues yet and it’s been montha.

 

[pledosophy]

The LFS suggested I put the shrimp in first which might help with the aggression of the sixline (or maybe I’ll just get a chill one) and I need my ammonia to be zero (still hovering at 0.25 ppm) and likely some more algae before I should toss them in...


I guess both the yellow eye and tomini are kole so can’t have both, makes sense. Any other tang I could put in with the yellow eye or maybe another fish you would suggest? At this point I am leaning towards 6 fish is where I am at haha.

I am glad you mentioned that, I do have a bottle of pods that I got as a door gift at the CFM and I should prob toss those in. I was going to toss some rock rubble in the fuge area should I dump them in there or just go straight in the DT?

the pods I have are “apex pods”, pic below

I wouldn't add any snail, fish or coral at all until you can feed the tank and have the ammonia be 0. It's bad for the longevity of the animal.

In a tank your size you can really only do one tang. If you already have a tang and wrasse picked out other fish that can be fun in your size aquarium would be a trio of firefish, a captive bred manderin goby (don't get a non CB one), midas blenny if you don't get the lawn mower, or maybe a hawk fish.

Apex pods are great if they will breed for you. You just want to get them started before the tank is to stocked. Having a healthy pod population is huge in preventing so many other problems.

 

[CoffBoss]

Your kitchen just on the other side of the wall? Where is the fridge? This coming week I’m going to be tapping into my ice maker line and run 1/4” tube from it to my float valve. Do away with the jug. Might work for you too depending if your fridge is close by. My fridge and tank are back to back. Have a whole house filter plus another just for ice maker. Haven’t had any issues yet and it’s been montha.

I have a plan for the future to do something of this sort so I don’t have to refill smaller jugs. I have been working on my water changing station today so that is the first step. For now the jugs aren’t too bad and I just run a hose into the house from the RO/DI unit and go straight into the ATO jug haha. I haven’t carried any buckets yet and that’s how I’d like to keep it!

the start of my water change station:

 

[CoffBoss]

I wouldn't add any snail, fish or coral at all until you can feed the tank and have the ammonia be 0. It's bad for the longevity of the animal.

In a tank your size you can really only do one tang. If you already have a tang and wrasse picked out other fish that can be fun in your size aquarium would be a trio of firefish, a captive bred manderin goby (don't get a non CB one), midas blenny if you don't get the lawn mower, or maybe a hawk fish.

Apex pods are great if they will breed for you. You just want to get them started before the tank is to stocked. Having a healthy pod population is huge in preventing so many other problems.

little too late to not have animals, but they are all doing great so far! The clowns are full of personality an love to eat. The theee snails haven’t stopped eating stuff so that has to be good.

I think I might have killed the pods before they had a chance, should they be moving in this bottle?

those are good fish suggestions, I’m going to ponder it haha thanks